himself. again, i have no direct knowledge of this, but this is what i am understanding. i did hear from very concerned friends that she was struggling a few weeks ago, so i had not seen her in years, but i reached out to here her, and she sounded good. >> but you knew her personally -- >> no, no. i treated her for three weeks in a celebrity rehab episode several years ago and i always had contact with her for various levels, and i did not treat her and i was not her physician, but when i heard she was struggling, i did reach out to her and urged her to go take care of herself and get to a facility if she needed and there was good support around her to do that, but the biggest fear was stigma and what people would think if, god forbid, she would take care of herself. that is the most distressing part, and we have lost her and, did not have to go down like this. >> if you can continue to talk to us about that. people have all kinds of illnesses, cancer, hiv, there's such a stigma when it comes to issues of that matter.